Oil Independence Day 2006

Discussion in 'General Motoring' started by Linda, Jun 22, 2006.

  1. Linda

    Linda Guest

    High gas prices have created a new group of people -
    "pump grumblers."
    When pumping our high priced gas, we grumble words of
    resentment, while feeling powerless. We need gas, so
    we pay the price. Standing as a individual we are
    powerless, but together our voices would be heard.
    America is a strong, independent country.
    When John Kennedy proposed we put a man on the moon, a
    goal and time line was set. American determination
    made it happen. Let's apply the same initiative to
    independence of oil through alternative energy
    research and use. We already have brilliant minds who
    are making great strides towards this goal.
    Demand that the President stand up for us.
    Ask him to support Alternative energy to free us from
    oil dependence,
    starting today. Millions of letters cannot be ignored.

    Write a paper letter before July 4 to the President.
    Urge friends and family to do the same.
    President Bush
    The White House
    1600 Pennsylvania Avenue NW
    Washington, DC 20500
    Down Load a letter at
    http://oilindependenceday2006.com/
    Pass this on or add a link to your web page.
    From:
    Linda
     
    Linda, Jun 22, 2006
    #1
  2. Linda

    SnoMan Guest

    Nice pipe dream but what you have not figured out by now that
    whitehouse is in bed with big oil and this is a wasted effort. We use
    the equivelant of 125,000 semi tanker truck loads of the stuff each
    day in US and it is growing and it is not unlimited in supply. More
    energy sources and conservation is needed but this is not done by
    giving consumer $100K breaks on fuel hungry SUV's. Also consider too
    that Bush pushed to build more big oil freindly oil and natural gas
    fired power plants when he took office to strain supplies further
    rather than mandate coal plant (we have a 300 to 500 year suppply of
    known reserves and more than anywhere else in the world too) Also the
    same BTU content of oil that is in a ton of coal costs 6 times more
    today so eeven with expensive scrubbers for emmisions from coal plants
    it is cheaper to use coal but it is not controled by big oil which
    control whitehouse. Recently in Motna , the gdemocrating governer is
    pushing for a 10 billion dollar coal to fuel plant in a area with over
    1 billion tons of proven coal reserves but the republican sec of state
    is trying to block it because it is not part of big oil and threatens
    their strangle hold. Why do you think Bush talks about hydrogen as
    fuel of the future? It is because it is something that big oil can
    make, ship, market and sell whicgh they cannot do with coal based
    technology or electric cars (one of the main reasons that electric car
    is not being exploited in markets that it could do well in). I m not a
    tree hugger but I do regognize that things must change while most
    ignore it.
     
    SnoMan, Jun 22, 2006
    #2
  3. Linda

    BläBlä Guest

    [Garbage Snipped]

    Do not feed the Trolls.
     
    BläBlä, Jun 22, 2006
    #3
  4. Nobody wants a full-size SUV hybrid. Bubba Joe Sixpack likes a big
    truck with a powerful engine. NASCAR Dad doesn't want a vehicle that
    automatically regulates performance for greater fuel efficiency.
    OTOH, Soccer Mom likes the VUE. For this reason, the VUE Green Line
    is somewhat promising.

    The majority of people in this market want a compact or midsize car.
    Sorry if the profit margin isn't to GM's liking. Here's a bit of
    irony: Honda and Toyota hybrids are selling at premium prices.
     
    Thomas Armagost, Jun 26, 2006
    #4
  5. Linda

    BläBlä Guest


    You know you can get the best frig'n Hybrid made on this planet and it
    wont save you a damn dime in the short or long run. That is the whole
    point of a hybrid aint it? To save money by not spending so much? Why
    does anyone want to pay a premium on a brand new car that will take
    100,000 miles before it starts to turn a profit on that price
    difference?

    Do not fall for the Hybrid Hype. Somewhere people got this fallacy that
    the point of the hybrid is to save gas and forgot the real point was to
    save MONEY.

    irony: People are stupid.
     
    BläBlä, Jun 27, 2006
    #5
  6. Linda

    Ritz Guest

    Oh I dunno 'bout there. I suspect there are lots of people out there
    that don't need to save the money and are doing it simply to burn less
    gas and "save the environment." Not that I think it will help, but I
    suspect that's also a strong motivator, not necessarily saving money.

    Cheers,
     
    Ritz, Jun 27, 2006
    #6
  7. Linda

    BläBlä Guest

    Guess you havent heard of SMUG!

    :)

    With cars burning as clean as they are a H2 probably creates less
    pollution than a room full of hippies. (Especially if you cant afford to
    drive it...) Personally I dislike both.
     
    BläBlä, Jun 27, 2006
    #7
  8. In message <WM0og.1809$>,

    It's impossible to know how high the price of gasoline at the pump
    will be in the years ahead.

    The 2007 VUE Green Line will cost $2,000 more than the standard
    4-cylinder model.

    <http://www.hybridcars.com/saturn-vue-hybrid.html>

    If hybrids continue to gain in popularity, the sticker price will
    probably decrease eventually.
    Saturn should attract this kind of customer.

    But why no Ion Green Line?
     
    Thomas Armagost, Jun 27, 2006
    #8
  9. Linda

    SnoMan Guest


    Not really, while hybrids will not save you much money at all if you
    drive on highway a lot but they can do wonders in city traffic because
    the capture the energy that is normally wasted braking and use it to
    relaunch the vehicle. The future is going to belong to some sort of
    hybrid car concept that has not been developed yet.
     
    SnoMan, Jun 27, 2006
    #9
  10. Linda

    SnoMan Guest


    Maybe not exactally but you can forecast a trend. I predict some
    $4/gallon fuel before end of 2007 and deisel fuel could hit that this
    winter if it is a cold winter. It would have last winter if it had
    been a cold winter. If you do not plan on high fuel prices in coming
    years you will pay the price because like it or not it is coming.
     
    SnoMan, Jun 27, 2006
    #10
  11. Linda

    Private Guest

    The big cost questions that nobody is asking about hybrids are,
    How long will the batteries last?
    What is the battery replacement cost?
    including disposal of the old batteries which will probably be considered
    hazardous waste?
     
    Private, Jun 27, 2006
    #11
  12. Linda

    SnoMan Guest


    Good question, Toyota warrants their batteries for a long period of
    time and they recycle the batteries in them and do not just through
    them in the trash. Most are going to lithium batteries which can have
    a long service life and a much higher enery density per pound than is
    even remotely possible with lead acid.
     
    SnoMan, Jun 27, 2006
    #12
  13. In message <>,
    Gasoline has been heavily taxed in some parts of the world for decades.

    BTW, check out these pictures of the Saturn PreView concept car, which
    was on display at the New York Auto Show in April.

    <http://www.caranddriver.com/autoshows/10887/saturn-prevue-concept.html>

    It doesn't seem to have much rear or side visibility. It looks as if
    the front end of an Acura sedan has been welded onto the bumper of a
    VUE. The rest of it sort of resembles a Nissan Murano--and sort of
    resembles an Infiniti FX35 or FX45.

    Will the "twin-turbo diesel engine" burn biodiesel fuel?

    Saturn will replace the Ion with the Opel Astra hatchback in late
    2007. So says Edmunds.com.

    <http://www.edmunds.com/insideline/do/FVDP/Preview/styleId=100728677>

    The idea is to "push up its base price and reduce overall sales
    numbers." Yes, we wouldn't want to build too many compact economy
    cars. ;-)

    GM doesn't want to spend "money to develop an all-new vehicle
    specifically for the U.S. market." Why was the SL/Ion sold in the
    U.S. market only? The wildly popular Ford Focus proved that the
    SL/Ion could have sold nicely all over the world.

    I think that the present management at GM hasn't got the slightest
    clue why Saturn came into existence.

    Cancel my pilgrimage to Spring Hill, Tennessee.

    <http://www.iht.com/articles/2005/12/01/business/saturn.php>

    It's just another brand of car.
     
    Thomas Armagost, Jun 28, 2006
    #13
  14. Linda

    SnoMan Guest


    As far as I am concerned they do not tax it enough because if they had
    more years ago we would not be in the bind we are in now and people
    would have used it a bit wiser and everone one pays a fuel tax unlike
    income taxes that have large loopholes for the wealthy. The rate of
    fuel tax is constant (it does not change with price of fuel) so the
    amount that goes to tax on each gallon does not change whether gas is
    $2 or $4 a gallon That money is going to producers, marketers and
    future traders. If you want to pick on someone pick on Reagan that
    opened up oil to futures trading in 80's and this profit taking easily
    adds 10 to 15% to price of fuel and adds to its price instabilty
    greatly as they try to drive prices up from time to time for profit.
     
    SnoMan, Jun 28, 2006
    #14
  15. Saturn will replace the Ion with the Opel Astra hatchback in late
    Buy a Honda, it's made in the USA. Don't buy a Saturn, it's made in
    Germany. ;-)
     
    Thomas Armagost, Jun 29, 2006
    #15
  16. Linda

    Ritz Guest

    That's why I bought a VUE. Honda reliability, but made in the USA. :)
     
    Ritz, Jun 29, 2006
    #16
  17. Linda

    SnoMan Guest


    And Honda's are a real pain in a arse to work on when they break too.
     
    SnoMan, Jun 29, 2006
    #17
  18. Linda

    Ritz Guest

    They're ALL a pain to work on when they break. I'd rather roll the dice
    on a the Honda 3.5L + 5A drivetrain than anything comparable GM has at
    this juncture. If the VUE had a GM powerplant/trans I wouldn't have
    purchased it.
     
    Ritz, Jun 29, 2006
    #18
  19. Linda

    SnoMan Guest


    I am not saying the a GM engine is better but I am saying that a Honda
    engine is not the best either. I had a freind that used to drive Honda
    for years until he got tired of getting skinned to get it worked on
    out of warranty. Honda are okay when they are new but you do not want
    to have one grow too old on you.
     
    SnoMan, Jun 29, 2006
    #19
  20. It could be worse. The unfurled printout of recall notices could be
    over six feet high. I've had two such cars.

    The VUE is a typical "New World Order" vehicle. It's a Frankenstein's
    Monster made of parts from anywhere and everywhere on Earth. This
    year the V6 is a Honda engine. A few years down the road Saturn may
    switch to an Opel diesel engine. Or Volvo. Or SAAB.

    Will GM even bother to continue supporting the Green Line when Saturn
    changes the VUE's style?
    You're supposed to buy a new car every 3-5 years.
     
    Thomas Armagost, Jun 29, 2006
    #20
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